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MOA Email Newsletter on group riding

glenfiddich

TravelsWithBarley.com
I was really surprised to read the piece about the rules of group riding, complete with duties of the road captain, group and sweeper. I've never actually seen Beemers in a group ride; at least around these parts we all tend to ride our own ride and meet up for food or socialization...before riding our own rides back wherever we came from.

http://www.bmwmoa.org/news/general_interest/motorcycle_tourism_group_riding

Is this a common practice in other parts of the country? I always thought of it as a cruiser thing: slow, upright, and in formation. Not knocking it; it's just not behavior I've observed among my fellow R, F or K bike riders.

Pete
 
<< Is this a common practice in other parts of the country? >>

Pete, like you, I've never seen a group of BMWs together, unless they're at a rally. I have ridden a lot in small groups (4 or fewer) and there are usually two BMWs in the pack, but that's not what this subject is about, is it? You're right, mostly BMW folks tend to ride solo, or in pairs maybe.
 
Group riding is real and it can be dangerous to your health unless everybody follows a few simple rules. Brand of bike has nothing to do with it, anybody who has done a toy run or anything similar knows what I'm talking about.

Its important to have a discussion about this before you head out, even if there is only 2 of you.
 
I've even quit going on our club rides. I hate it....just not safe.
We have tried talking to the group, but it's still like hearding cats.
10-12 bikes get strung out over 3/4 of a mile with traffic trying to enter from side roads....someone is going to eat it before long.

Ken
 
I've organized a bunch of group rides over the years (anyone remember the Blitz to Morganton?). After the first one I did, a small group afternoon ride to Harpers Ferry which was a bit of a mess, I resolved never to try to keep people together in a group again. Instead I've simply printed out route sheets with stops for lunch and such and let people go at their own pace. I think it is really the only safe way to do it. Riders tend to clump together in small groups of folks who ride at similar comfort levels, and everyone ends up together at the stops anyway (just some much earlier than others ;))
 
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I've organized a bunch of group rides over the years (anyone remember the Blitz to Morganton?). After the first one I did, a small group afternoon ride to Harpers Ferry which was a bit of a mess, I resolved never to try to keep people together in a group again. Instead I've simply printed out route sheets with stops for lunch and such and let people go at their own pace. I think it is really the only safe way to do it. Riders tend to clump together in small groups of folks who ride at similar comfort levels, and everyone ends up together at the stops anyway (just some much earlier than others ;))

Although as an MSF instructor, I can teach Group Riding (4-Hr. classroom block), I rarely see such principles adhered to by most riders.

I like Ted's approach to the issue. :thumb
 
Having rode in and even led group rides I do have a few pet peeves.
  • Speed. If you zip along up front, those in the rear go faster to keep up and sometimes make mistakes
  • Passing. When you pass a vehicle and then leave room for only yourself to get back over in front of the vehicle you just passed (usually on controlled access roads or multiple lane highways).
  • Again passing. Passing on curvy roads in a no passing zone and then disappearing, assuming everyone else will "Catch up".
 
Every Second Saturday

West Michigan BMW has a ride usually after a breakfast from Grand Rapids. I have been on one ride with them, again with 150 dogs in our rescue I just find it very hard to ride 50 miles to meet up with group.

The one time I did ride, there seemed to be a new LT rider: He was too green to ride in a group in my opinion. I have been on March of Dimes (lots or V-twins), and a couple other charity rides.

If everyone is a good rider a group can be a nice time, but with a too aggressive or green members can make you wish you where on a solo ride.
 
We have tried talking to the group, but it's still like hearding cats.

Amen...we have had some groups that behave well together 6-8 in size with close matched skillsets. Not a Cruiser parade but a lively well working group.

...others have been a mess even when split up to groups of 6 with seperate leaders. Especially when going to a large event such as a dealer's open house or a multi club meet-up. These start in a rural town and end up in a metropolis full of hazards. Folks feel the need to be all together at their own peril and will do dumb stuff or string out for miles and really cause a routing mess. I have been lead and sweep on these and it's stressful.

Labeling one a faster group and one the B group only encourages the less skilled riders to try and prove they can hang...and sometimes it doesn't go well.

Even when the leader is doing the speed limit and trying to ease and back down speed...it becomes an accordion of chasers in the back...the leader swears he was doing the limit...as sweep I was cussing. Some folks get up to speed and group ride well...some are really meant to do the lone rider thing.

Since it seems you have to be a Type A to be riding bikes in the first place:laugh...trying to "coach" ANY A-Cats is a futile effort. Even at 55 years old, some folks think I am a whippersnapper and to just lead them to the event..."Don't suggest I ride differently in a group" has crossed my ears more than once.
I had ridden with the Cruiser crowd over several years...it was the craziest/scariest thing to witness. I rode my GS in a mostly V Twin group that was escorting the Vietnam Wall travelling display a few years back...Great cause ...but Boy-O-Boy:bolt

Lately it seems we are trying the " here's a map and the location...seeya there" style. As the club president...that seems to be the better way to allow folks to do their own thing.
 
I have done several rides with the Combat Vets Assn. and it's a totally different experience. Very enjoyable. Everyone stays spaced well, staggered formation, and even change lanes and pass in formation.

I guess it's just the military experience/training that comes into play.

ken
 
I have done several rides with the Combat Vets Assn. and it's a totally different experience. Very enjoyable. Everyone stays spaced well, staggered formation, and even change lanes and pass in formation.

I guess it's just the military experience/training that comes into play.

ken

You're on to something there, Ken.

I witnessed many groups of Combat Vets Assoc. members motoring about at The Dragon around Father's Day this year, when I was at Deal's Gap with my son tearing up HWY 129 with reckless abandon. They were well-clustered and orderly, moving with discipline.

In 2003, I was part of 124 LEO Motor Officers from around the nation that left East Troy, WI every day for a solid week and rode all over the greater Milwaukee area for exhibitions and dignitary escorts as part of Harley-Davidson's 100th anniversary celebrations.

Helicopter footage showed us moving as a tight, single unit, whether in heavy commuting traffic, off-ramps, parking lots, etc.

That kind of precison comes from professsional training and plenty of experience.

3 weeks ago, I completed a 2,000+ mile ride to Lake of the Ozarks and NW Arkansas with two buddies. Had all to do to keep this rather small 'pack' together in even moderate traffic. :banghead
 
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Prime Directive: Never pass up an opportunity to not ride as part of a group.

Riding is something that I do alone but some times we end up doing together. What do you do in ÔÇô Not a Group Ride Group Ride ÔÇô situations?

I would find some guidelines very helpful for these.

Example 1: At a rally finding yourself behind or part of an informal group heading out to a restaurant.
At the rallys I have attended I have found myself behind groups going to restarunts. When I have tried passing they have reacted in various ways. What is the best way to deal with this?

Example 2: On solo fall color rides I have found myself unintentionally part of a 'pack' of disperate motorcyclist, with no ride captain and cages treating us like one group.

How do the rest of you deal with these?
 
Example 2: On solo fall color rides I have found myself unintentionally part of a 'pack' of disperate motorcyclist, with no ride captain and cages treating us like one group.

How do the rest of you deal with these?

2 Options; Left turn or Right turn. Unless the rest of them turn left or right, in that case only 1 option; straight ahead. Except if you came to a T intersection, in which case "punt".

Yeah I was reading that article in the current MOA about group riding, if I ever found myself in a situation where the rules of the group ride were being recited, I think you'd hear my bike start before he/she was done speaking.
 
Group rides are in a way like formation flying, best to be done with similar, aircraft or motorcycles. Done both on many occasions the more dissimilar the greater the difficulty
Four is the absolute max I'll ride with
Whatever you do everyone needs to know the PLAN
 
When I started reading about "Road Captains" and "Sweepers" I turned back to the cover to make sure I wasn't reading a Harley publication.

Just a few observations -

* I loved the sentence that said, "The captain's main objective is to protect and lead the group to the destination with joy, satisfaction and safety." "Joy"? Really?? :stick Maybe something got lost in translation.

* I guess I'm biased because a big group to me is when I go out with two other riders. Any more than that and I feel like I'm herding cats (or I'm one of the cats being herded).

* I was out riding several weeks ago and kept crossing paths with a group of Harley riders. The "Sweeper" was driving a big SUV and pulling a trailer. :dunno

* I like Ted's approach. Hand out a route sheet with stops for lunch and the final destination. Let people ride at their own pace.

* A group captain wouldn't want me in his/her group. I hate to ride in a staggered formation. (I'm retired Army. I spent 30+ years in formations.) I like to keep changing my line to see what the people behind me do. :nono

* I've done a few Edelweiss Tours. By the end of the day my nerves were shot . . . so many different riders with so many different styles. The next time I ride in Europe I'll ride alone.
 
Well,
Our club does monthly ride to eat where about 1/2 ride together to get there and half coming from other directions just show up. While the group may be self selecting so attracts folks of similar riding skill/experience, we have very few issues and it makes for a nice ride.
Most of the folks who show up are very experienced- they're regular rally attendees, ride cross country, commute regularly on bikes, etc and have for many years. We always have a couple pillion riders and female operators- equally experienced. Once is a rare while we get a relative novice and when that happens, our leader will pull a couple mph off the pace especially in twisties to eliminate getting a novice in a bit deep. No one complains about the pace and we ride the typical stagger- its a social group out having lunch with friends and that's what drives the atmosphere. We all understand if you want more serious play at speeds guaranteed to earn performance awards if observed, then the group ride isn't the place for it- but we don't stay under all posted speeds either, when out in the country.
We've had no safety issues or problems BUT our routes also take us on country roads outside of metro areas or even most small towns so we're not in traffic. And here in eastern NC, we have a lot less blind, decreasing radius turns than one finds in western NC.

Our group size rarely exceeds 8 machines and a dozen people.

I share reservations about really large group rides and wouldn't join one of those large side by side Harley parades on a bet- around here they're full of folks who put maybe 2000 a yr on their bike and only take it out when they know the ride won't cause an hour of chrome polishing- those bikes aren't even on the road in our mild winters. I also don't have any appreciation for someone else's unmuffled pipes in my face- there is no reason I can think of that would get me to tolerate that.
 
Riding is something that I do alone but some times we end up doing together. What do you do in ÔÇô Not a Group Ride Group Ride ÔÇô situations?

I would find some guidelines very helpful for these.

Example 1: At a rally finding yourself behind or part of an informal group heading out to a restaurant.
At the rallys I have attended I have found myself behind groups going to restarunts. When I have tried passing they have reacted in various ways. What is the best way to deal with this?

Example 2: On solo fall color rides I have found myself unintentionally part of a 'pack' of disperate motorcyclist, with no ride captain and cages treating us like one group.

How do the rest of you deal with these?

I ride most of the time with my wife Annie. Our rule is to stay far enough apart so that it does not matter what part of the lane we are in. Essentially we treat each other as if the other person is in a car and give space accordingly. It is not uncommon for us to be a 1/4 mile apart on a rural road or slab. Getting separated is not a big issue. We use radios and generally know where we are headed. If we encounter a group we either keep our distance, pull over or pass if the situation permits. Space = Safety.
 
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