Dead Short

[179212]

Bike 1994 R1100RS
The bike had set for week or ten days on job site in covered trailer, went to job site unloaded bike and moved it out of the way rode made a short circle and parked bike in shade did not notice if abs reset. Worked 4 or 5 hours than took of in light rain for the 167 mile ride home trying to stay ahead of severe weather. When I left the abs thing did not reset so went a couple blocks to first stop sign shut off bike restarted no reset, rode about 60 miles at a spirited pace got to interstate went a few miles to rest area stopped drank so tea took of for the last 100 miles to home moving a bit faster than traffic and trying to stay ahead of storms averaged about 95 mph for next 80 miles last 20 or 30 on two lane highway not a lot slower. Parked in garage put charger on bike using power port on starter cover. I had problems getting battery tender to charge switched chargers play with cord batter charged up had green light started bike rode to end of driveway and back abs reset as it should all seemed well. Rode to job site and back next day and bs would never reset tested battery voltage at power port using suspect adapter plug voltage 12.8 to 13.3 put charger on over night next day left to help friend harvest corn ( abs no reset ) stopped about 30 miles down road for gas try to restart bike the dreaded click, click. Pushed bike over to shady spot try to jump bike or call for help took plastic cover off starter to use plus cable that runs from battery to starter hooked up jump box using best ground I could and nothing called for help while that was coming removed some Tupperware and the air box intake tube and removed battery tried jump directly on battery cables nothing ( red light came on on jump box that I had not seen before. Put jump box on battery and let it charge ( still waiting for wife had decided I would drive with her to dealer and get new battery only $130).
While still waiting took battery off jump box attached plus cable when I touched neg cable to terminal sparks flew jiggled cables some thinking plus cable was shorting against battery box tried again still dead short, wife came hauled me and parts I had removed home where I got the truck and some help retrieved the bike.
Put the pc680 on charger and it charged right up in a hour or so.
My attempts at diagnosis checked plus cable from battery end to harness no visible shorts, put charged battery in attached plus cable tested voltage across battery terminals 13 something tested voltage from neg cable to battery ( key off) same 13 something voltage no fuses blown so tried testing unfused circuits pulling relays 3,4,8 made no difference still have dead short .
So what should next step be?

 

[roger 04 rt]

Disconnect the +12v cables at the starter and see if that removes the short.

 

[179212]

Short

Removed that first no different I got the dead short after I removed neg cable and slid battery out after charging battery some with jump box had bad short upon reconnection.
From wiring diagram cable to starter also goes to alternator maybe that is problem area.
Looks like it would be easy to access wiring harnesses if abs and ignition modules removed!
Could also spend 2 grand and replace bike
Will check alternator area this evening, have to haul corn today
Question what is easy way to access bottom of fuse box under seat?

 

[beemerphile]

By battery jump box, are you talking about one of those small lithium jump start batteries? The instructions on mine say to NEVER leave it connected or use it to try to charge a battery. It is only to be connected while jump starting.

 

[179212]

Jump sterter

By battery jump box, are you talking about one of those small lithium jump start batteries? The instructions on mine say to NEVER leave it connected or use it to try to charge a battery. It is only to be connected while jump starting.

You are correct it is the small lithium battery thing, you correctly assumed I did not read instructions that came with thing ( they were about 200 miles away), when your sitting by the side of the road and it's about 90 outside and you are no longer in the shade you try stuff.

 

[beemerphile]

You are correct it is the small lithium battery thing, you correctly assumed I did not read instructions that came with thing ( they were about 200 miles away), when your sitting by the side of the road and it's about 90 outside and you are no longer in the shade you try stuff.

Not scolding, just wondering if that may be the source of your current problem - as a place to look.

 

[harryhendo]

Get an electrical multimeter, and set it to AMPS (you want to test draw, not voltage). Remove the positive battery cable, and connect one lead of the multimeter to the positive battery cable, and the other lead to the positive battery post. Observe the reading on the ammeter. It should be just a few milliamps (to run the clock, etc). If you see an amp or more, remove each fuse in turn to identify the circuit in which the short resides (the amps measurement will drop to near zero when you remove the fuse whose circuit has the short). Trace the wiring for that circuit to the short.

 

[kioolt]

That is a good way to find a short by pulling fuses but in this case he has something that pulled so much current that it melted the battery post. My guess is like a said before is a loose negative battery terminal. If I remember correctly it appeared to have melted when he tried to start the bike. I'm not sure what size the biggest fuse is on the bike but none of them alone should be able to pass enough current to melt the battery terminal and at the same time not melt any wires.

 

[179212]

Short

On the wiring harness where the positive wire branches off to go to alternator the old cloth electrical tape ( friction tape ) is shiny looks odd will do some tape removal tomorrow morning. If I find nothing will try to figure out the fluke multimeter see if I can measure amps.
Thanks for help

 

[dieselyoda]

If you have a dead short, all measuring amps will do is confirm you have a dead short.

Easiest way to find a dead short is with a plain, ordinary test light and if you don't have that, use a bulb wired to the negative cable and the negative post. Bulb lit bright, you have a short.

Using an old compass and passing it over the bike will get you close to the short. If that doesn't work, break the harness open at the various connectors until the bulb glows dim or goes out. Last connector you broke open, your short is in that circuit.

Dead shorts are usually the easiest electrical problem to find, sometimes.

 

[179212]

Short

Do not seem to have short any more but starter just clanks when I try to start bike and plus lead on starter getting warm after a few tries, so capital cycle and EME have replacement starter for $119 and EME also has a new Valeo starter for $189 so what should I get bike has over 80,000 miles on it so may be starter time, I know I have done nothing to starter in last 60,000 miles
Beemer boneyard has valeo starter for $199 minus MOA discount
Enduralast or Valeo?

 

[Omega Man]

Do not seem to have short any more but starter just clanks when I try to start bike and plus lead on starter getting warm after a few tries, so capital cycle and EME have replacement starter for $119 and EME also has a new Valeo starter for $189 so what should I get bike has over 80,000 miles on it so may be starter time, I know I have done nothing to starter in last 60,000 miles
Beemer boneyard has valeo starter for $199 minus MOA discount
Enduralast or Valeo?

Perhaps a read of this Best of Forum will help- https://forums.bmwmoa.org/showthread.php?69483-A-peek-inside-your-starter
OM

 

[179212]

Thanks

Thanks OM will go get starter off bike and order enduralast starter $70 bucks cheaper if I be making a mistake with the cheaper starter forum members please let me know!

 

[oldcamper]

This ebay vendor has sold 205 starters with generally good feedback:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-STARTE...ash=item1e859536cd:g:RHIAAOSwx7laEQGE&vxp=mtr

$56 for a new starter for a BMW R1100.

I’ve used ebay Caltric brand starters on my BMW and riding mower with good results, but they are a bit more on ebay than the vendor above.

 

[179212]

Starter

This ebay vendor has sold 205 starters with generally good feedback:

https://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-STARTE...ash=item1e859536cd:g:RHIAAOSwx7laEQGE&vxp=mtr

$56 for a new starter for a BMW R1100.

I’ve used ebay Caltric brand starters on my BMW and riding mower with good results, but they are a bit more on ebay than the vendor above.

Thanks for info looked at link hit buy button what is the worst equivalent too French made Valeo will update after it arrives Friday and I get it installed.

 

[179212]

Short

New starter seems to have fixed problems must say $56 well spent
Thanks for help

 

[happy wanderer]

New starter seems to have fixed problems must say $56 well spent
Thanks for help

If your starter was the original from 94 chances are you have the older Valeo D6RA which had glued in magnets. These failed at an alarming rate and when a magnet came loose the result is a dead short and the starter jams up as it cannot spin with the loose magnet in the way. It was replaced with the D6RA-75 which has metal clips inside that retain the magnets better and also a longer bendix gear. Mine burned out on a 96RT I had back then. Took this photo when I replaced it.