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Ethanol, Do you Avoid Using Gas Containing Ethanol?

I live in Clive, IA...western suburb of DSM. Right now 10% ethanol costs 27 cents less/gallon than the 89 octane (supposedly pure) alternative. I'd prefer the unadulterated version but my bike seems to run just fine on either. Although the fuel economy does suffer with the corn mix.
 
I live in Clive, IA...western suburb of DSM. Right now 10% ethanol costs 27 cents less/gallon than the 89 octane (supposedly pure) alternative. I'd prefer the unadulterated version but my bike seems to run just fine on either. Although the fuel economy does suffer with the corn mix.

It used to be a nickel less


Sent from my iPhone, inspected and certified by the NSA
 
I live in Clive, IA...western suburb of DSM. Right now 10% ethanol costs 27 cents less/gallon than the 89 octane (supposedly pure) alternative. I'd prefer the unadulterated version but my bike seems to run just fine on either. Although the fuel economy does suffer with the corn mix.

The "problem" here is that you have NO idea whether or not you are buying corn laced fuel. Not a requirement of the Evergreen State to have separate dispensers, just a label that says may contain up to 10% ethanol. No way to tell until you get a tank full and notice the reduction in mpg. Only one station in our particular region that sells only pure gas. The pure gas nets me about 10% or so better mileage, so I just watch the prices and pay a bit more for "premium" regular grade go juice when the pric differential warrants. Interesting to me that when we're in Iowa that the options are clear, in the Puget Sound it's a bit of a crapshoot. Since my R11S sits more that it goes, I only put pure gas in it...

Cheers!

PS. Is Clive anywhere near Johnston? (my family name)
 
The "problem" here is that you have NO idea whether or not you are buying corn laced fuel. Not a requirement of the Evergreen State to have separate dispensers, just a label that says may contain up to 10% ethanol. No way to tell until you get a tank full and notice the reduction in mpg. Only one station in our particular region that sells only pure gas. The pure gas nets me about 10% or so better mileage, so I just watch the prices and pay a bit more for "premium" regular grade go juice when the pric differential warrants. Interesting to me that when we're in Iowa that the options are clear, in the Puget Sound it's a bit of a crapshoot. Since my R11S sits more that it goes, I only put pure gas in it...

Cheers!

PS. Is Clive anywhere near Johnston? (my family name)

It's not far. Waukee is on the west side of Clive, then there is Urbandale and Johnston the east and northeast. I used to work in Johnston and it was a 14 mile ride.
 
I need to correct a statement I made about gasoline in Canada.

I had a wonderful chat with a fellow that does the same stuff as me and we both had a good giggle that our government's short sightedness and that the pony-tail granola munchers think they are winning while we are making a lot of money and putting a lot of young men to work. Sad to flip the other coin and say I have customers losing very expensive engines and productivity.

He has done some testing, as I have and the First Nations Aboriginal Peoples that own gas bars, don't have to follow the rules. First Nations with a valid Treaty Card do not pay the requisite taxes as well. Therefore, they can source fuel at their discretion and can even buy back our Canadian fuel from the USA with no duties or taxes. Just transport costs. They can sell 100% gasoline with no Ethanol, and they do in some places.

My single handed statement that you can't buy fuel in Canada with at least 2% renewable resource content is wrong. You can buy 100% dino-fuel on First Nations reserves if you look for it.
 
The "problem" here is that you have NO idea whether or not you are buying corn laced fuel. Not a requirement of the Evergreen State to have separate dispensers, just a label that says may contain up to 10% ethanol.

PS. Is Clive anywhere near Johnston? (my family name)

Lots of places in Iowa seem to have one hose dispenser and a separate button for 10%, Premium, Mid-grade, etc. Labels are missing or not clear often. Always fill with premium/no ethanol if the bike sits for a month or more. Last winter in Iowa was one of those "or more" kinda winters ;-(

Looking forward to heading up to the MOA Rally in a couple weeks! Hopefully will be a bit cooler than Sedalia was.

Mark
 
Northern Wisconsin and the Michigan UP have good availability of non ethanol fuel and the stations have signs promoting it. But octane will generally be no higher than 91.
 
Northern Wisconsin and the Michigan UP have good availability of non ethanol fuel and the stations have signs promoting it. But octane will generally be no higher than 91.

Spent a week in that area back in may. Almost every BP station had non ethanol fuel.
 
For my new bikes, it's hard to avoid if you ride in California.

For my old bikes that don't get many miles I run leaded race gas or 100LL aircraft fuel.

Even at that I drain the fuel systems in the old bikes when I put them away.
 
No, But it just about all you can get around here.
And they increase the percentage in the winter months too.
 
I just completed a 22 state trip. In a lot of areas ethanol blended gas seemed to be all that was available. In Iowa I saw a few pumps that offered an 85% ethanol blend.

I talked with a fellow that was a long time corn seed sales guy. He was really familiar with ethanol fuels and the studies that have been done. He indicated what I had heard elsewhere, which is for small motors like lawn mowers don't use fuelmwith ethanol, and for anything that will set a while without being used don't use it.

Where I live in eastern WA non-ethanol gas is easily available, especially at the commercial fueling stations. For those that live in an area where it isn't as available I wonder if it may be more easily obtained at a commercial station?
 
Using the pure gas web site and app I was able to travel from Alabama to Oklahoma City, spend two weeks riding in OKC and back (a different route) without ever putting ethanol* in the tank. I planned the route based on the locations of ethanol free gas stations. I traveled up on a Sunday so I did have to call ahead and check hours of operation before selecting that location. It took effort, it took time, it was fun!
*i think I got ethanol in two gas stations as my mileage on the MFD did not reflect the "non ethanol" mileage I'm used to. You can only do so much.

At home I travel the 45 minutes to Dothan or other locations to keep the high octane ethanol free gas in the bike. I suppose it would be inconvenient if you considered going for a bike ride an inconvenience. It takes some initiative, at times it's a challenge, but it is doable.
 
Greg

Your argument would make more sense if you quoted credible sources for your energy content claims. As is, I can find no reputable source that states your values for gasoline or ethanol energy content. If you check around, reputable references indicate that ethanol has 2/3 to 70% of the energy (BTU's/gal in the old system of units) content of gasoline. Then, you can do the calculation of cost per mile.

Or, from a different perspective, you can consider the historic variation in inflation adjusted corn and wholesale gasoline prices. While corn returned to the 1984 price levels in 2012, it has dropped at least 20% since that time. During the same period, the cost of unleaded gasoline rose sharply after 2002 and plateaued at nominally 160% of the 1984 price.

If the use of corn for ethanol was driving it's price and availability for food, shouldn't we expect the corn commodity price be higher than in the pre-gasohol days?View attachment 45760

Looking at the chart, unless I'm reading it wrong, and I fully expect you to correct me, you always do, but the corn commodity prices ARE higher than the pre-gasohol days (early 1970's I believe way left of the chart). Corn commodities in this chart seem to go up over time and seem to follow the increase in wholesale petroleum pricing. The chart seems to demonstrate that corn commodities are now closely tied to petroleum costs (or usage) and as those prices over time always creep up so too corn. I think this chart clearly demonstrates why farmers are seeing drastic increases in cost associated with corn products for agricultural use.
 
Looking at the chart, unless I'm reading it wrong, and I fully expect you to correct me, you always do, but the corn commodity prices ARE higher than the pre-gasohol days (early 1970's I believe way left of the chart). Corn commodities in this chart seem to go up over time and seem to follow the increase in wholesale petroleum pricing. The chart seems to demonstrate that corn commodities are now closely tied to petroleum costs (or usage) and as those prices over time always creep up so too corn. I think this chart clearly demonstrates why farmers are seeing drastic increases in cost associated with corn products for agricultural use.

E10 didn't start becoming widely available until after MBTE was found to be a groundwater contaminant and was replaced by ethanol as an oxygenate. That occurred around 2003.
 
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I definitely go out of my way to put pure gas in my bikes. It's pretty readily available in TN, generally about 0.30/gal higher than E10. Depending on the station, they may have only 91 octane premium, or only 87 octane regular, or all three grades. The Pure-Gas app for iPhone is great - gives you the nearest sources to your location, but you do have to pay attention to the direction. They also have a POI file that can be loaded into your GPS with the same information.

I just bought a 2006 R1200RT and asked the seller if he used non-ethanol gas - "100%, never put anything else in the tank." He said that's what causes the fuel strips to fail, and he's never had a problem in any of his bikes with the fuel strips.

Ethanol in gasoline has devolved into an entirely political issue. Even the EPA admits the environmental effects of ethanol are neutral at best, but Big Ag (the "corn lobby") is spending a lot of money to force E15 down our throats. It's really easy for a politician to get behind something that *looks* environmentally friendly while getting his pockets lined. The corn lobby has also been promoting the higher octane of blended fuels, and the uninformed public (me included until recently) confuses octane with energy content.

Although I've not seen any actual cost analysis, I have heard that blended fuel does not cost any less to produce than pure gas; it's only government subsidies that keep the price at the pump lower than pure gas. If the government allowed free market economics to work, ethanol blended fuels would disappear.

Basically the US Government has done what it does best - invent a problem, find a solution that is actually worse, spend billions to make it happen, all the while worrying more about getting re-elected than actually helping country. I encourage you to contact your Senator and Congressman, asking them to support HR 1462 and S 344.
 
Basically the US Government has done what it does best - invent a problem, find a solution that is actually worse, spend billions to make it happen, all the while worrying more about getting re-elected than actually helping country.

Pretty much sums up the interstate Highway System.

Curse them, one and all......
 
Reading the above, I got curious & googled "corn lobbying $ amounts" and then got lazy after seeing too many to wade through. 1st was a $300-600k annual from corn growers assn., then it got serious with corn refiners @ $ 16+ million annually & so on...
I have always wondered how you "spend" that much money in a lobby effort, given that it's unlawful to make outright gifts to politicos-other than PAC type campaign contributions, where does it really go? I know this forum cannot carry this conversation very far but it boggles my mind how it all comes together? In my state, KY, like most, the lobby guys cannot even buy their dinner now days yet millions spent. How?


Beyond politically made "repairs" whats the beef with the interstate hwy system? -other than fact much of it's falling apart.
 
the lobby guys cannot even buy their dinner now days yet millions spent. How?

Campaign ads. It's free speech. The dollar amount just changes the size of your bull-horn


Beyond politically made "repairs" whats the beef with the interstate hwy system? -other than fact much of it's falling apart.

It was sarcasm directed at the blanket statement in a prior posting.
 
Other than A/C or racing fuel, E-10 is about all you'll find in SoCal. Good news is CA is blocking E-15, so I guess we're getting the lesser of two evils. Bike runs OK, but runs stronger and gets better mpg on non-ethanol fuels.

Funny that if E-10 or E-15 is such a wonderful fuel, why is forbidden for use in aircraft? And using these fuels will void a lot of vehicle warranties (yep, saw that in writing in the owners book of my Nissan truck).
 
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