Transport Canada and BMW issued a recall on multiple models

Transport Canada and BMW issued a recall on multiple vehicle models
On certain motorcycles, cracks could develop in the fuel pump and/or auxiliary fuel pump flange (if equipped). This would result in fuel leaking when the engine is turned on and the fuel system is pressurized....

And we here in the USA been trying to get this done for how many years?

kthutchinson said:

And we here in the USA been trying to get this done for how many years?

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No kidding. This has been a problem for some time now, particularly on the R1200RT.

Let's hope this forces a redesign by BMW.

Say, how does Transport Canada feel about Final Drives?!

Looks like it took them nearly 10 years to smell the fumes?
Great timing though! Yesterday I was cleaning out some shop stuff & came across a bag with a pair of black plastic "you know whats" inside. Volia! I wonder if I lawyer up & maybe tell them what's going on "up north", I can cash in? I spent some serious money for metal "you know whats"! And then , of course, all those hours(billable hours for civilians) of research reading about o-ring materials & fuel line materials,ad infintum, etc.,etc.!
If I'd only saved that old FD seal for evidence that's long gone...

Here's a question for our Canadian members. Does Transport Canada make documents related to recalls available on-line? NHTSA makes available letters between NHTSA and the manufacturer, service bulletins, copies of the actual recall letter to owners, and other documents for every recall. I couldn't find anything similar on the Transport Canada web site. It would be nice to see the paper trail on this one.

Motorcyclists remain the weakest and failing part in the monitoring and recall systems of the United States and Canada by their gross under-reporting of problems to the system. File a complaint with NHTSA or Transport Canada; they are not just for cages.

Yes you can lawyer up when you have a problem. One of the first things you will be paying attorneys fees for will be a search of government data bases for related complaints, investigations and recalls to support your case. Under reporting to the agencies does not help get problems taken care of by the agencies or plaintiffs recover damages.

Yes I do see merit in associations having liaisons or advocates as part of their member benefits. Their leverage is limited. Like attorneys, they will be most effective if they can leverage reports to the monitoring agencies. Our under reporting undermines that process.

I will quickly agree with anyone who expresses frustration with the speed or these agencies response to complaints and the sense that motorcyclists seem to be second class citizens for the agencies focus. However, how much of that is the result of our relegating ourselves to second class status by under-reporting?

We already pay taxes for these agencies. Put them to work for motorcyclists. When you have issues file a report.

kthutchinson said:

Here's a question for our Canadian members. Does Transport Canada make documents related to recalls available on-line? NHTSA makes available letters between NHTSA and the manufacturer, service bulletins, copies of the actual recall letter to owners, and other documents for every recall. I couldn't find anything similar on the Transport Canada web site. It would be nice to see the paper trail on this one.

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http://wwwapps.tc.gc.ca/Saf-Sec-Sur/7/VRDB-BDRV/search-recherche/menu.aspx?lang=eng

I've been there. The only information available is the recall announcement, the same announcement as in the original post.

As said before by someone, considering the actual mileage motorcycles put down the road, in aggregate, considering the lack of discussion concerning the need of the complexity of today's motorcycles, FI, cat. Converters, water cooling, multiple on board computers, switches for whatever, brakes, suspension, riding mode, engine management modes, and on and on. Progress? Complexity? Recalls?

It would seem to make sense to just build bikes with the simplest systems practical to what a rider needs to git on down the road commensurate with the total possible environmental aggregate effect the few of these bikes could have. These systems could then undergo decades of development thus practically eliminating failures as mentioned. Ya wonder where it's all gonna go, or end. Maybe computer controlled robots driving bikes with MOA members sitting in an approved sidecar.

An acquaintance,this summer, unfortunately riding a bike with an on off switch for "riding mode" regular, sport, whatever, while taking a corner inadvertently hit the sport mode and plowed into a parked cage. But we're all safer and better motorcyclists having such a system wired into the controls. And the more complex bikes become, the more recalls will be in the works. More complexity doesn't conform to better biking, less recalls. This is a reflection on where I think motorcycling and motorcycle development headed in the last few decades, and the actual need for certain types of technical development, its cost, and its return and the resultant recalls.

kthutchinson said:

I've been there. The only information available is the recall announcement, the same announcement as in the original post.

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I didn't get a chance to follow through. If you follow that link and and the ones on the sidebar, you can find some history, including any actual instances of damage/injury. It's cumbersome.

kthutchinson said:

I've been there. The only information available is the recall announcement, the same announcement as in the original post.

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http://www.tc.gc.ca/eng/contact-us.htm#general

This may be the place to start looking for the supporting documentation. Contact Transport Canada and ask for the information you desire and or how to apply for access to it.

8ninety8 said:

As said before by someone, considering the actual mileage motorcycles put down the road, in aggregate, considering the lack of discussion concerning the need of the complexity of today's motorcycles, FI, cat. Converters, water cooling, multiple on board computers, switches for whatever, brakes, suspension, riding mode, engine management modes, and on and on. Progress? Complexity? Recalls?

It would seem to make sense to just build bikes with the simplest systems practical to what a rider needs to git on down the road commensurate with the total possible environmental aggregate effect the few of these bikes could have. These systems could then undergo decades of development thus practically eliminating failures as mentioned. Ya wonder where it's all gonna go, or end. Maybe computer controlled robots driving bikes with MOA members sitting in an approved sidecar.

An acquaintance,this summer, unfortunately riding a bike with an on off switch for "riding mode" regular, sport, whatever, while taking a corner inadvertently hit the sport mode and plowed into a parked cage. But we're all safer and better motorcyclists having such a system wired into the controls. And the more complex bikes become, the more recalls will be in the works. More complexity doesn't conform to better biking, less recalls. This is a reflection on where I think motorcycling and motorcycle development headed in the last few decades, and the actual need for certain types of technical development, its cost, and its return and the resultant recalls.

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Excellent point. Just because you can build a more complex motorcycle doesn't necessarily mean you should.

That's a lesson that BMW will likely never learn, as they have swapped reliability for technological complexity.

We thought we 'needed' single-sided swing arms to the rear wheel - to save weight, they told us. Instead, the torque of that fad now eats final drives (crown bearings, seals .... whatever) for breakfast, lunch and dinner. Engineering logic supports (no pun intended) that a drive wheel be braced equally on both sides. Ah, but what of progress......!

Different drive modes to choose from (though most riders can't even tell the difference) - that used to be more easily accomplished by the rider himself/herself making adjustments to clutch/throttle/brakes to fine-tune the performance of the bike in different scenarios. Ah, but what of progress............!

Fuel strips instead of floats, rear shocks that have a replacement cost in the thousands, headlamps that are incredibly difficult to service, an 'electrical nervous system' (canBus) costing more than 4 sets of tires from my Sonata to entirely replace (beware of mice!) ............... the list goes on and on. Ah .............. progress.

All this recall says, which applies up north, not here, is that BMW will install a reinforcing ring.
Most of us already done that. And replaced the plastic qds also. So big deal. There's more to it than they admit in this Canada only thing.
As usual, I'm better off on my own.
dc

greenwald said:

Engineering logic supports (no pun intended) that a drive wheel be braced equally on both sides.

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I sure don't see many cars built that way. Your statement has no basis at all.

AntonLargiader said:

I sure don't see many cars built that way. Your statement has no basis at all.

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Cars don't have a single drive wheel in the rear - I thought that might have been obvious, given we were discussing motorcycles.

sans posi rear end you have a one wheel wonder, the norm for years.

The thread I started does talk about motorcycles...a fuel system problem not final drive.

That doesn't change anything about your statement from a technical standpoint. You cite 'engineering logic' but there isn't any. Engineering isn't about what sounds good to the ear or looks good to the eye. If a drive wheel needs support on both sides (which it apparently doesn't) then it needs it on both sides.

AntonLargiader said:

That doesn't change anything about your statement from a technical standpoint. You cite 'engineering logic' but there isn't any. Engineering isn't about what sounds good to the ear or looks good to the eye. If a drive wheel needs support on both sides (which it apparently doesn't) then it needs it on both sides.

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It's obvious you didn't like my statement, and that's OK. But engineering, in its purist form, is steeped in logic. Since the days of Archimedes, certain principles are timeless, and how engineers construct a motorcycle, from rake to power-weight ratios to steering degrees to final drives all start out with logic as a common denominator.

However, what finally makes it to the showroom floor is often a compromise between engineering logic and what the mother ship feels will appeal to the customer - sales and style over function is not a new concept in this industry.

You had me worried I misspoke, so I ran my comments past two employed master mechanics at the local Honda shop. It resonated well with them. They even pointed out that, albeit few problems all totaled, they have had some minor torqueing issues with the Gold Wing being a "single swing arm" design on such a big bike. The design doesn't make sense to them other than to save weight. I asked how important that was, presuming acceleration and MPG issues were the payoff. I learned that most bikes have so much reserve power in higher gears before redline, that a single swing arm is a non-factor, other than how it appears (asthetics - the predictable "bandwagon principle") and the fact that they personally like how much easier it is for them to change out a tire in the shop. Otherwise, weight is not really robbing much 'power' on a modern motorcycle engine not used for racing and most touring bikes they see on the road are so overloaded with gear (GVWR out the window) that MPG couldn't have been that big a concern to the rider in the first place.

But mika is right - this thread is about the over-due recall on the fuel system - not FD's or the semantics of what "engineering logic" means to you or I.

So, back to our regularly scheduled program.

David13 said:

All this recall says, which applies up north, not here, is that BMW will install a reinforcing ring... So big deal.

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That's how I see it.

Anyway, maybe Mike Figelski will get a nice big order of clamping rings from BMW Canada.

David13 said:

All this recall says, which applies up north, not here, is that BMW will install a reinforcing ring.
Most of us already done that. And replaced the plastic qds also. So big deal.

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Yep, here's a pic copied from I-BMW of the new BMW part. Not much different than the repair a lot of us have done.



More pictures from I-BMW
Here's the BeemerBoneyard ring.





QDs from Beemer Boneyard