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Skyline Drive: First Time a Victim of Anti-Motorcycle Bias

Those who know my writing style suspect I might normally pen volumes in rebuttal to the direction this thread had taken. Tried a different approach a little while ago - that was "all bark and no bite."

But really, why? This Forum is open season on LEO's - has since I first jumped onboard 9 years ago. I endeavor to remind myself that it only represents <4% of the membership.

I've been around MOA'ers now for nearly a decade.... almost as long as I associated with the H-D crowd as a motor officer.

And then there's the time I spent six days in the thick of things at Daytona Bike Week in '04.

Never ceases to amaze me who has the greater respect for and more objective understanding of law enforcement. :violin
 
Human nature seems to be that the bad stuff sticks the best in our memory - at least for me this is true. I've had my fair share of interactions with LEOs; most of them have been have been speed related. A handful have been for no reason at all or a fake reason, just to pull me over. Most have been fairly pleasant interactions, but the ones that really stick with me are the ones that were unwarranted or unprofessional on the part of the officer. Threads like this bring back the bad memories and I'm sure they do for others as well.

Unfortunately, every time I see an officer on a bike or in a car at this point, I start watching my mirrors to see if I'm going to get pulled over, even when I've done nothing illegal. Just being on a motorcycle, I find myself being tailed at times, although much less often on my BMW than I was on my KTM dual sport. The bad apples (or in some cases, bad departments) create enough ill will to tarnish all LEOs even when most probably don't deserve it.
 
I agree with rxrider. My experiences with traffic police has been largely infrequent and without problems. In fact, I appreciate professional agencies like the OSP and wish there were more of them, a lot more.

True story: Several summers ago I and my wife were sitting on our front deck sipping some cools ones when all of a sudden out of the woods, our home is surrounded by dense woods and foliage (brush), came two cops dressed like storm troopers. I immediately jumped up out of my chair with beer in hand. The lead cop yelled at me to "put that down!" I yelled back "what the F?" and he placed his hand on his side arm and yelled "I said put that down". I immediately put down the beer and raised my hands. The cops just continued on their way running through our property and off into the adjacent wet lands. I later learned that they were looking for a bad guy. This episode was just plain scary! I really had the feeling that if I didn't put down my beer that I might have been severely injured. It is events like this that can give one a very bad taste in one's mouth. You here about instances where unarmed people are shot and killed for just running away from a cop. Excuse me but merely trying to get away from a cop is not reason for the cop to use deadly force. If some of these men in blue can't get a grip on their adrenaline rushes then they ought not to be working in public service. Again just imo. Oh, I think those two cops should have taken the time to come back and apologize for their excess that summer afternoon and maybe explain their actions a bit. I don't appreciate being threatened by people that are supposed to serve and protect.
 
Oh, the shame

I've never gotten a speeding ticket, ever. I probably shouldn't admit that on this forum. I've come close a few times. The last time was a very hot, humid day and I was trying to get home before the weather set in. It was obvious from the thunderheads that heavy rain was imminent. I had my mesh jacket on, but had no rain gear with me. Doing about 10 over on a 55 mph state road, a local sheriff pulled out, turned to follow me, bubble lights going. Just then, the skies opened up in a serious downpour. The sheriff ended his pursuit. He apparently didn't want to get soaked by the heavy rain! I observed the speed limit the rest of my trip, about another five miles, and considered getting thoroughly soaked preferable to getting a speeding ticket.

Harry
 
Well Harry, perhaps he was showing some common sense courtesy to you? Knowing you would be sitting there getting soaked while he ran your tags or wrote you up. After all, he gets to sit in the car.

Sent from my DROID4 using Tapatalk
 
< Mod hat for a bit here


As Kurt posted yesterday, this thread started about one riders experience and how he dealt with it...A lot of us have been in this situation, I said a lot, I do not have stats. Remember the forum participation is a smidge of the membership as mentioned.


This has turned into less of a motorcycle topic that Motorrad is for and more of standing around the Campfire and moaning about the ticket we/you/I got or almost got. So off to the fire ring it goes. Once again opinions are OK until you cross the double yellow with a flamethrower. Some of these posts are starting to have that smokey flavor.


It has turned into folks venting about their opinions about how the folks who are just doing their job do their job. Imagine most of y'all know this diverse group of MOA has just about every profession represented in our ranks. Some of us know folks in this profession...some are relatives , some friends,some just names on a screen or we just haven't shook hands with eye to eye yet.

Making generalizations about who various jurisdictions hire is pretty harsh...you know these folks from the military are best suited for the reality of police work. A crew cut and attitude while on duty aren't a good indication of character, have met some really polite LEO's who also were ex-military...have met a few that had a different view than me...OK there as well. Kind of nice about our country ya know?

How many bad apples are in your basket of friends/profession/career ...just sayin'. Some of those may cause 80% of the stops 20% of us get to participate in. There, I used the 80/20 rule somewhere.
Calling these people out sure seems a bit one sided as we will never know the complete story leading up to an incident. Maybe there's a forum for that, as there sure are a lot of them out there.

I hope an electrical lineman hasn't crossed your wires...hate to see the heat from that here when your lights/heat go out:wave

Mod hat off for now>



My experience has been I typically contribute to most cases where I have been stopped. I can count on half of one hand when I was shocked to have a roadside chat. I have been stopped more in a hot rod car than ever on a bike, but that's not bike related so I digress.

I ride a motorcycle, ride it maybe a little smarter than I did when I first got a permit at 15..I hope. I bend the laws...have been told there is only black/white on rules, I often challenge them...and deal with whatever those bring me. I do not go stupid stunting , but yes I do roll on a lot. I got pulled over more on a different model bike...but there are a lot more knuckleheads and that brand of motorcycle out on the road, so the odds were pretty high I believe.Once again...no stats, just a cup of personal experience.
And like Paul said earlier...when the limit is 80/85 around here away from the big city...and you get stopped for 5-20 over that...you are on your own. :violin
 
I've never gotten a speeding ticket, ever. I probably shouldn't admit that on this forum. I've come close a few times. The last time was a very hot, humid day and I was trying to get home before the weather set in. It was obvious from the thunderheads that heavy rain was imminent. I had my mesh jacket on, but had no rain gear with me. Doing about 10 over on a 55 mph state road, a local sheriff pulled out, turned to follow me, bubble lights going. Just then, the skies opened up in a serious downpour. The sheriff ended his pursuit. He apparently didn't want to get soaked by the heavy rain! I observed the speed limit the rest of my trip, about another five miles, and considered getting thoroughly soaked preferable to getting a speeding ticket.

Harry

Harry, You need to get out there and try harder. Don 't shoot for reckless driving and arrest the first go around... Just a simple 12 over the limit will do. :D
 
Well, as I mentioned previous-like there is another Skyline, very famous here, from south of San Francisco into Santa Cruz on highway 9. I was up there just last month. Perfect weather. And such a beautiful road thru' the woods and hills (mts.).
I know law enforcement never bothers me any.
dc
 
In many areas, traffic tickets are, uh, "additional road taxes" under the guise of "public safety". If you don't believe that, just look up privatization of traffic enforcement, and how jurisdictions have allowed, for example, riskily reduced yellow light times as a revenue "enhancement". Locally here, you can regularly see NHP ignore cars tailgating 25 feet off at 70 ( a relatively cheap ticket for a very dangerous action) but they sit on radar and look for people speeding on clear roads (a much more expensive ticket for a safety nonissue).
My point here is, if public safety is often a dishonest premise, that much traffic enforcement is really just an ad hoc road tax, which certainly appears the intent of many who make the laws, why should it then bother us if the mere tax collectors are less than stellar? As usual, the problem really is with those higher up the food chain, who give the marching orders.
 
Well Harry, perhaps he was showing some common sense courtesy to you? Knowing you would be sitting there getting soaked while he ran your tags or wrote you up. After all, he gets to sit in the car.

The fact that he did a U-turn, had all his lights going, and started a pursuit told me that he was going to at least pull me over. The downpour started right then, and the only thing I can attribute to his ending the pursuit was the heavy rain. He would have had to get out of the car to ticket me. I got lucky.

akbeemer: I'm a cheapskate, and paying more for insurance is a big motivator for me to not try too hard.

Harry
 
Well, as I mentioned previous-like there is another Skyline, very famous here, from south of San Francisco into Santa Cruz on highway 9. I was up there just last month. Perfect weather. And such a beautiful road thru' the woods and hills (mts.).
I know law enforcement never bothers me any.
dc

I remember riding Skyline back in the 80s. I was on my RS and moving along at pretty good pace. Then with a flash of white and the scream of a banshee I get passed by a TZ750 in full race trim. Came to find out that people would ride whatever they wanted however they wanted. The police responded to the carnage.
 
A couple of comments regarding an earlier post about Texas. First, it is not at all unusual to get a TICKET from a Texas State Trooper at 4 or 5 over the limit. They may well stop you for a chat at 2 or 3 over. Local police departments and sheriff departments might be a little more lenient - but maybe not.

Their rationale for being strict is this isn't a little 55 mph state. In western Texas and parts of east Texas the two-lane rural speed limit is 70. Much of it is 75. Some Interstate is 80. The attitude is, "We give you 70 or 75 or 80! How much more do you think you'll get???"

If perchance you want to suggest that a few mph is within the error of your speedometer you might hear the suggestion that you could get an equipment fix-it ticket too.

Paul, if you're referring to my post, none of my incidents happened in areas that are any different to anywhere else in the country. TX may be unique in the 80 MPH limit but that didn't get implemented until after I left. My experience is that Texan enforcement will nail you for speeds that won't even wake them up in other states in similar environments and conditions.
 
Paul, if you're referring to my post, none of my incidents happened in areas that are any different to anywhere else in the country. TX may be unique in the 80 MPH limit but that didn't get implemented until after I left. My experience is that Texan enforcement will nail you for speeds that won't even wake them up in other states in similar environments and conditions.

That too, is sort of my point. Five to ten over is not ticket-safe in Texas. But,

I live along TX 118. A nice two lane asphalt highway between Alpine and Big Bend National Park. The speed limit is 70. Basic rural 2 lane speed limit. In Kansas where I used to live it would be 65. In Missouri it would be 60. In Iowa where I used to live it would be 55. This has been true since the day Nixon's 55 national energy conserving speed limit was repealed.

I am not aware of any other state which has a 75 mph speed limit on two-lane state highways and farm-to-market roads like in west Texas. I'm sure somebody will tell me otherwise if I've missed them. I would have suspected Wyoming and Montana as the most likely but haven't found it since the overturn of reasonable and prudent - which I always described as reasonably imprudent.
 
That too, is sort of my point. Five to ten over is not ticket-safe in Texas. But,

I live along TX 118. A nice two lane asphalt highway between Alpine and Big Bend National Park. The speed limit is 70. Basic rural 2 lane speed limit. In Kansas where I used to live it would be 65. In Missouri it would be 60. In Iowa where I used to live it would be 55. This has been true since the day Nixon's 55 national energy conserving speed limit was repealed.

I am not aware of any other state which has a 75 mph speed limit on two-lane state highways and farm-to-market roads like in west Texas. I'm sure somebody will tell me otherwise if I've missed them. I would have suspected Wyoming and Montana as the most likely but haven't found it since the overturn of reasonable and prudent - which I always described as reasonably imprudent.

Paul, as a person who has ridden across the US and a lot of Canada many times, which would you prefer: 1. lower speed limits that are sporadically enforced and hence often violated with the expectation you won't be pulled over if you are no more than 10 mph or higher above the speed limit; or 2. higher speed limits on similar highways (as you have in Texas) but little slack to people even slightly over the limit.

You have the experience in miles to tell us not only what you prefer but also what makes you feel safer.

An essay answer is acceptable.
 
I ride with some retired Troopers here in MT and they tell me they still wrote many tickets when Reasonable and Prudent was the law of the land. For instance, a Trooper is on the interstate doing 85 MPH and gets passed by a BMW M Class car doing 100 MPH... no issue assuming the weather conditions are okay. Then the Trooper gets passed by a family of five in a ten year old Dodge Caravan doing 100 MPH. The Caravan is getting pulled and the driver is getting a ticket. Differences: childeren involved, age and capabilities of the vehicle and tires. According to my friends the tickets almost always survived a trial. R&P inspired some to perform and act silly in front of LEOs because they thought the law was a license to do whatever they wanted, and that turned out not to be reasonable or prudent.

Montana is still a great place to ride. You still run 80 on the interstates and 70-75 on most rural two lane roads which is fast enough for me these days. And there are many great places to ride.
 
Well, as I mentioned previous-like there is another Skyline, very famous here, from south of San Francisco into Santa Cruz on highway 9. I was up there just last month. Perfect weather. And such a beautiful road thru' the woods and hills (mts.).
I know law enforcement never bothers me any.
dc

Found that road last year. Very memorable ride through the hilltops with views of the ocean and Silcon Valley to the East. Only sad part is when you end up in the traffic of South San Fran. :eek
 
I ride with some retired Troopers here in MT and they tell me they still wrote many tickets when Reasonable and Prudent was the law of the land. For instance, a Trooper is on the interstate doing 85 MPH and gets passed by a BMW M Class car doing 100 MPH... no issue assuming the weather conditions are okay. Then the Trooper gets passed by a family of five in a ten year old Dodge Caravan doing 100 MPH. The Caravan is getting pulled and the driver is getting a ticket. Differences: childeren involved, age and capabilities of the vehicle and tires. According to my friends the tickets almost always survived a trial. R&P inspired some to perform and act silly in front of LEOs because they thought the law was a license to do whatever they wanted, and that turned out not to be reasonable or prudent.

Montana is still a great place to ride. You still run 80 on the interstates and 70-75 on most rural two lane roads which is fast enough for me these days. And there are many great places to ride.

I have many fond memories of life under the Big Sky. I lived and worked in Yellowstone NP in the 70's for about 5 years when the day time speed in MT was reasonable and kind of prudent but fell to 55 mph at night. Anyway, I was motoring over the Bozeman pass (Bozeman to Livingston) on my new '79 Suzuki GS1000E at 100+mph right past a MHP that had stopped a semi. Next thing I know here comes flashing blue lights moving mighty fast so I pull over. The cop motions me to approach his vehicle and get in on the passenger side. They used to do that in MT to see how you walk, follow instructions, and/or smell funny. Anyway, he gives me a ticket for 5 dollars for wasting natural resources (fuel) and collects the 5 bucks on the spot. Problem was I only had a 20 and he couldn't make change. So, we agreed to meet the following week in the park whereas I would pay him the five which I did. Was humorous when he pulled me over as he chewed me out because I obviously had no respect for law enforcement because I blew by him without slowing down then he went through a half a tank of the tax payer's gas just getting up to speed to catch me. All and all great fun and I made a friend on the MHP.
Oh, he thought he really had me because I had a MT registration but an Oregon drivers license. Since I lived on a federal reservation I was OK.:)
 
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