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Simple but brilliant tip

Hmmm, the word always always scares me. I use both front and rear brakes to stop even though brakes are linked. As I stop, if I need to put down my right foot for some reason due to terrain, debris on road etc, its okay, I still have a front brake to hold the bike. Once settled, if I need to hold the bike, then I can apply the rear and release the front. Oh and when I went through our motor school, if you are the bike on the right when riding pairs, unit policy (for looks?), your right foot goes down. So good tip, I think a lot of people may do it without realizing, its just trying to balance the bike as you stop, but if you have it in your head that you always have to stop with left foot down and right on the brake (and no front brake) then you will roll back and fall over when you throw out your right foot when for some reason you tip that way. I think the more important thing is just to stop without falling over.
 
round here, this time of year, when I am going east I have left foot down, going west it is right foot down and brakes have nothing to do with this choice.

Rod
 
Thank you bikerfish1100 and ANDYVH (posts 19 and 20) for pointing out my mis-reading of Andy's previous post.

I appreciate that this tip may well not work for beginners because, as stated, they have yet to learn nuance of bike controls. Might it be something to mention at classes beyond the beginner level?

Am I correct that, even for beginner classes, you teach "easing off" the front brake and harder application of the rear brake as you almost stopped? While we have seen people do "stoppies" safely (at least on dry pavement,) I guess we could agree that is not the preferred method on the road for even very experienced riders. I try to be completely off the front brake at about 1 mph to avoid the possibility of a front wheel lock-up, though my fingers are still over the lever if I have to put my right foot down - which this tip should make a very rare occurrence.

Those of you who are laughing at this "much ado about nothing" are probably "naturals" who never gave it a thought and can't remember it ever being a problem. Just remember, we all have different natural abilities. Those of us who have to really think about and practice something to learn it DO eventually turn that learning into a "natural" response; but we are probably better teachers because we remember how we learned a particular skill. True for me anyway, and I taught many things - but not how to ride a motorcycle.
 
Might it be something to mention at classes beyond the beginner level? Possibly.
Am I correct that, even for beginner classes, you teach "easing off" the front brake and harder application of the rear brake as you almost stopped? While we have seen people do "stoppies" safely (at least on dry pavement,) I guess we could agree that is not the preferred method on the road for even very experienced riders. I try to be completely off the front brake at about 1 mph to avoid the possibility of a front wheel lock-up, though my fingers are still over the lever if I have to put my right foot down - which this tip should make a very rare occurrence.

Those of you who are laughing at this "much ado about nothing" are probably "naturals" who never gave it a thought and can't remember it ever being a problem. Just remember, we all have different natural abilities. Those of us who have to really think about and practice something to learn it DO eventually turn that learning into a "natural" response; but we are probably better teachers because we remember how we learned a particular skill. True for me anyway, and I taught many things - but not how to ride a motorcycle.

Actually, I teach just the reverse, as the shortest stops will happen when you continue to get stronger with the front brake as one approaches the finish of the stop. Again, at the basic level, we are trying to teach students to use the most effective method for stopping. We don't worry nearly as much about finessing a 500-800 lb bike to a smooth easy stop as we do about getting a 300 lb trainer (and eventually their own bike) stopped in a distance that avoids having conversations with officer friendly , their insurance company, and the kind folks at the ER.
You are less likely to get a front wheel lockup by braking strongly at the end of a stop than you are to get one by braking too hard at the beginning of one. Grabbing the front brake when it's time to stop is poor technique- load the front tire first, then get strong on the brakes. I teach it as "not a faster squeeze, just a longer one. If you are moving, you are continuing to squeeze more." Weight transfer needs to happen first, as this puts more effective weight loading on the front tire, increasing it's traction. More traction = more stopping friction available. More friction = shorter distances needed to stop without fear of lock up.
Crash avoidance is the name of the game. I'll accept a tipover at the finish over stopping the bike in the back seat of the Buick.
 
I think this is a great tip. As far as putting your left foot down and right foot on the brake, I would say that is the best practice where it is practical There will always be exceptions due to terrain etc, but yes it is taught for a reason.

Once this rain quits I am definitely going to go out and see how this works in practice.

No, the rain will not quit & everything is rotting here in KY! Maybe build an ark?
At a stop I like to get both feet on the ground(when logical & possible) and rise up so as to place body weight on my feet-it's good for my legs, back, circulation and general safety too-if you need to backpedal,etc..
 
Well I doubt I'd be called a natural but I'm getting seriously bored with the nuances of this topic.
But for the record, left foot down almost all the time, 2 feet if stopped too long or on some oddball terrain. Right only- rarely.
Startup goofs on hills that I've seen appear mostly to be a matter of crappy clutch/throttle coordination - not made any easier by the R bike's dry clutch narrow engagement area. However, I'm so used to it I'm actually sloppier on stuff with wet clutches, as odd as that sounds, mostly because you can be.
Time to move some of that parking lot slow speed stuff out to some real world slopes for newbies??
 
First off, as MSF RiderCoaches we can't deviate from the standard MSF curriculum, so we can't as part of the Basic Rider Course (BRC) teach the technique. The BRC is taught as a BASIC (hence the course name) training curriculum. Its purpose it to familiarize NEW riders with handling a motorcycle. The reality is that as RiderCoaches we have enough difficulty with some students in just getting rudimentary processes like clutch control through to them. The left foot down principle is taught as a standardized process to ingrain muscle memory in stopping the motorcycle. It allows the use of both brakes (earlier posters are correct in inferring that not all riders ride bikes with linked braking systems) while stopping, again helping ingrain the use/availability of maximum braking potential. We also teach to always shift down to first gear during the stop, before the rider puts his/her left foot on the ground.

All that being said, we all live and ride in the real world. There will always be circumstances where a rider will have to deviate from standard riding practices to address real world conditions. Whether that is a right foot down instead of a left foot because of road/surface conditions or other adjustments, it is incumbent upon the rider to recognize the riding requirements.

Is it a good idea to teach the technique of stopping with the handlebars turned? Perhaps in an advanced motorcycle riding/handling class it might be appropriate to address the technique, but certainly not in a basic class, where we are just trying to get students to stay upright... :thumb
 
I must be one of the lucky 'natural talent' riders. I can honestly say I never consciously think about any actions I take when riding my motorcycle, I just ride it. I don't think 'apply pressure on the left bar to go left', or 'apply brakes with even pressure', or 'put left foot down at this stop'...I guess it comes from dirt bike woods riding/racing. Wheelies, stoppies, skid steering, power sliding, off camber turns, logs, gravel, sand, boulders, traffic, crazy riders, spectators on the course, crashed riders in your path, rain, mud, fatigue, thirsty, dehydrated, flat tires, weak brakes, no brakes, front brakes only, dead engine, fall off, crash into fixed objects, weight shift for turns, throttle control, clutch control, no clutch, seat fell off, stand up, sit down....etc.

Some, all, or most of these things can happen to you evey time you race a dirt bike for 2 hours through the woods with 150 other guys! There's no time to think, you just have to react and initiate your actions.

That said, I do have empathy for those who don't have the luxury of being able to ride dirt bikes and have to learn about motorcycles on the road!. Heck, I even had to sell mine due to finances:mad
 
I guess you missed the part of me watching 3 bikes fall over on my last ride. In all cases, it was in a driveway. In the first, it was a turn into a driveway with a steep pitch. Because the rider did not stop with his foot on the rear brake, the bike rolled backwards and over it went. On the second two, it was again a driveway where there there were bikes trying to exit from a gravel drive and trying to merge with other bikes on the road. Two of them tipped over due to a lack of bike handling skill, which again was caused by not having right foot on rear brake. They were trying to turn right, there was a steep pitch to the driveway and there was gravel.

You have got to be kidding me. What a great reminder as to why I ride solo. Sounds like you should also consider it, or at least find some new riding partners.
 
Left Foot Down: Old technology

When riding "Solo" I use to use the left foot down method, due to using both hand and foot brakes. I've always stopped with 2 feet down when riding 2 UP, because it is much safer; especially when the passenger may adjust their seating position or other movement unexpectedly. Left Foot Down is old technology with the advent of BMW's "Hill Hold!" As most of us know, BMW is usually the leader in technology and in the case of stoping on a hill, BMW is way ahead. Since I purchased a new 2015 BMW R1200RT, with "Hill Hold" I have been using 2 feet down, even when riding "Solo": way easier and safer practice! BMW's "Anti Lock Brake System is so good and on the money, that it unbelievable!
I LOVE Jesus, I Love my wife: If you can't already tell, if you can use the word "love" to an object, I love our 2105 BMW R1200RT! The power and stopping abilities are awesome. First time in my 55 years of riding, that I have not been outrun by a Harley and have had numerous Harley riders look the bike over, when they see it parked. They have all commented on BMW being ahead of the curve on technology and just the awesomeness of the BMW's products.
Ride safe, keep the sunny side up and enjoy the scenery that God has so graciously given us.
 
Clean Foot-- Dirty Foot

I took an excellent advanced course (TOPS) taught by a Motor Officer. The cops use the "Clean Foot/ Dirty Foot" method which translates to coming to a stop in first gear, leaving the bike in gear, left hand on the clutch, with the left foot down and the right foot on the brake for the duration of the stop. There are some more cop related aspects like leaving a car length space in front of you and constantly monitoring the surroundings for an escape route. That way, if the need suddenly arises, you are ready to move away and pull out without having to fumble with the clutch & gear shift--- simply roll on the throttle as you lift your left foot and off you go.

Obviously, there is no "always" that this applies to, as in a stops on hills, slopes.
 
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