• Welcome, Guest! We hope you enjoy the excellent technical knowledge, event information and discussions that the BMW MOA forum provides. Some forum content will be hidden from you if you remain logged out. If you want to view all content, please click the 'Log in' button above and enter your BMW MOA username and password.

    If you are not an MOA member, why not take the time to join the club, so you can enjoy posting on the forum, the BMW Owners News magazine, and all of the discounts and benefits the BMW MOA offers?

Who did not attend because of the heat?

Who did not attend because of the heat?


  • Total voters
    100
  • Poll closed .
After reading this same old thing year after year about how somebody doesn't like something about the Rally, be it location, or time of year or whatever, I'm reminded of the rule in deer camp concerning cooking - the person who complains about the food is now the new cook. So far I've seen over the years people who do nothing but gripe, but have not offered to help other than to offer' "if I had MY way' suggestions. Well, have it your way, organize a rally, at a location of your choosing and a time of your choosing. Make sure the weather will be perfect for everybody, the roads all great, the scheduling coincides with that of all the attendees, etc. Make it happen. I'm waiting. Nobody is stopping you.

In the meantime, I'll just go on enjoying the efforts that have already proven to be successful, and go to the rallies, both local and national, that I can and choose to attend. And I'll continue to VOLUNTEER as I can. Maybe things won't be perfect, but at least we'll have fun in the trying.
 
Exactly

After reading this same old thing year after year about how somebody doesn't like something about the Rally, be it location, or time of year or whatever, I'm reminded of the rule in deer camp concerning cooking - the person who complains about the food is now the new cook. So far I've seen over the years people who do nothing but gripe, but have not offered to help other than to offer' "if I had MY way' suggestions. Well, have it your way, organize a rally, at a location of your choosing and a time of your choosing. Make sure the weather will be perfect for everybody, the roads all great, the scheduling coincides with that of all the attendees, etc. Make it happen. I'm waiting. Nobody is stopping you.

In the meantime, I'll just go on enjoying the efforts that have already proven to be successful, and go to the rallies, both local and national, that I can and choose to attend. And I'll continue to VOLUNTEER as I can. Maybe things won't be perfect, but at least we'll have fun in the trying.

I agree. Here is a challenge for everyone; find a rally site.

Believe me, it is not easy. For those of you suggesting specific locations; what would the venue be?

Are there 3000 motel/hotel rooms available?
Are there air conditioned [if needed] facilities for vendors and seminars?
How about RV camping?
Tent spaces?
Shade?
Good riding areas around and to the venue?
CAN WE SELL OUR BEER?

I have been looking for rally sites in the Southeast and GA law prohibits the BMWMOA from selling beer. If any of you good ole boys from GA know a way around this, let me know.


The rest of you; please post your suggested venues and I can assure you that someone will check it out.
 
I can no longer drink beer :violin

But I wonder , why is it so important that the club be allowed to sell their own :dunno

Is it a special micro beer produced by the MOA on their own label :scratch
 
Profit

I can no longer drink beer :violin

But I wonder , why is it so important that the club be allowed to sell their own :dunno

Is it a special micro beer produced by the MOA on their own label :scratch

It is the profit from the beer sales which fund a number of club needs.
 
Beer

Also consider the thought that having a Beer Garden keeps us on site, possibly preventing a bunch of DWIs.
 
****rant ***rant****

The reason we, the MOA, work so hard to control the beer sales is a long standing safety philosophy. We control the beer, we control the price, we sell as cheap as is reasonable to discourage our members from drinking off site and riding their bike under the influence. It really is that simple. Some members don't imbibe, some members bring adult beverages on site from local stores (pre rally we inform restaurants and liquor stores we are coming and suggest they stock up and staff up.) We have modified site contracts in the past to allow our members to bring liquor onto the site as it was contractually forbidden. The "control the beer" decision isn't about those who don't drink, it's about providing a venue for those who do. If we change that policy we are putting our members on the streets on their bikes.

I really grow weary of the annual discussions of "Why is beer so important" If many posters would stop and think of the responsibility Rally Chairs and other key volunteers feel for the overall safety of attendees, I believe these annual reviews would mitigate. If you think I'm making this up do a search, it comes up every year, by those not directly involved, and it's answered ever year by those of us who, some having been rally chairs, have gone to the hospital immediately after leaving the rally to check on the welfare of members who have been in accidents going to, during, or leaving our rallies. Many of us take member safety very seriously.

As far as the main thrust of this thread, weather, I'd really like to see some of the posters move beyond the hypothetical "ideal site, with ideal predictible weather, at the ideal time of year."
Start a thread, name the venue that fits our many needs, pick a date, I will then post the weather extremes for the site, or why the specific site will not work. Keyboard generalizations are easy, suggesting we could somehow reach some magicial consensus is easy. Fact is, it's actually very few of our 34,000 members commenting and we seldom reach consensus as a whole on anything beyond theory. Conspiricy theories abound but I ask you to ask yourself why your BoD would not choose this magical site with magical weather that would make ALL of our members happy and have an attendence of 34,000 if it existed and someone would point it out to us? Hummmmm?

If we had been in Sedalia when we were in Bloomsburg and Bloomsburg when we were in
Sedalia this thread wouldn't exist .....maybe. :bikes


Stan Herman
MOA Director (appointed, not enough people ran to fill the seats)
MOA Ambassador (my first committee Chairmanship involved a toilet plunger I used over 100 times)
National Rally Co-Chair Redmond
Co-inventor of the free water and sprinklers program in Bloomsburg
2012 Logistics Chair RA National Rally Copper Mt. Co.

Ya'all jump in there are plenty of volunteer positions available!
 
Last edited:
Well done, Stan!

You'll never please everyone and I've yet to find the person who can control the weather. But I'd like to say THANK YOU for all that you and the board members, rally chairs, and volunteers do!

For all those who feel they have a better idea or can do a better job, I'd like to suggest that you get more involved. Run for office. Volunteer in a key rally position. I'm sure your ideas will be heard and perhaps acted upon. I don't mean this to sound snarky but there are quite a few arm chair quarterbacks who have ideas but forget that this is a club largely run by volunteers.
 
I have been sitting on the fence not weighing. I first want to say I did not attend, because of the heat and I already logged in many of miles before this date and I was just tired of riding in 100+ days in the by the time this rally came around. Knowing Chuck, Julie, and Bob they went over board to make everyone visit to the MOA rally special. The problem lies within the MOA BOD. They are the ones that approve the rally sites, set the rally philosophy about the beer garden, approve the rally chair and set the dates, Etc.... Now what I am hearing is allot of complaints and the MOA BOD not listen because they held a rally south of Interstate 70 and was 95+ degree days. The MOA BOD is probably listening, I hope. The problem is if you want change, then we need to get rid of the MOA BOD members that we have now, and elect new members that will bring changes that are needed to this organization. Now if we do not elect new faces to the MOA BOD do not expect any major changes and expect the same thing year to year and all you can do is blame yourself for not being more involved and no changes.::banghead
 
I have been sitting on the fence not weighing. I first want to say I did not attend, because of the heat and I already logged in many of miles before this date and I was just tired of riding in 100+ days in the by the time this rally came around. Knowing Chuck, Julie, and Bob they went over board to make everyone visit to the MOA rally special. The problem lies within the MOA BOD. They are the ones that approve the rally sites, set the rally philosophy about the beer garden, approve the rally chair and set the dates, Etc.... Now what I am hearing is allot of complaints and the MOA BOD not listen because they held a rally south of Interstate 70 and was 95+ degree days. The MOA BOD is probably listening, I hope. The problem is if you want change, then we need to get rid of the MOA BOD members that we have now, and elect new members that will bring changes that are needed to this organization. Now if we do not elect new faces to the MOA BOD do not expect any major changes and expect the same thing year to year and all you can do is blame yourself for not being more involved and no changes.::banghead

Remember the last BMWMOA Election, 2 (TWO) positions were not filled becauce no one ran for them. :banghead
 
Stan;

I apologize if i caused you so much distress to have you rant about my beer question.
That was certainly not my intent. It was a simple question from a member. I was not aware that this subject is so touchy and gets beaten to death every year.

I get it and personally approve the decision to keep those who might overindulge on site and out of harms way, you can't fix stupid after all.

I also think it is good policy to have a profit center for the club to help with expenses, if that means selling a few beers then by all means do it.

As far as i am concerned , I enjoy what the MOA offers to me as a member. I am not a long distance rider, so unless the rally is held within a days distance or at the most two days away I will not be going anyway. Heck I don't even like driving in the car that far anymore, but that's just me.

As to the lack of member involvement in the BOD, that's a reality all organizations face. The folks who do get involved in group leadership or politics, either like what they get from it or don't last long.
Doug
 
Remember the last BMWMOA Election, 2 (TWO) positions were not filled becauce no one ran for them. :banghead

This is what I mean. Then the MOA BOD will look at only a select group individual and then make them BOD members. I have voiced my concerns about that issue in the past. I am sure BOD does not want me to bring this issue up again and again. This is why it is so important to have a true election and not rubber stamp election.:banghead So we are all at fault for this rally site, the days in which the MOA holds the rally. etc. Because as members we did not have enough Candidates to hold a true elections for the MOA BOD:banghead Trust me I have no fans on the MOA BOD, but if you want change make sure they have enough Candidates to have election to make change
 
Before the "forum voices" condemn the BOD and the MOA,
I think we need to take a breath here, show some mutual respect and get the personal vendettas out of the way.

If not we could easily end up the way the AMA has gone , total loss of respect for the members, the BOD and loss of members by the boat load.

Most of us, at least i think so , belong to the MOA for friendship , help with maintenance, advice on gear , and for many other reasons .
But mostly because we like BMW motorcycles
( well the chicks who ride them are pretty hot too):brow

Lets all remember we do this" hobby" for fun, very few are lucky enough to get paid for riding , sharing their adventures and telling us arm chair riders about them.

I doubt the BOD get enough reimbursement for their time and trouble to account for the tough decisions they need to make so stuff gets done , that many of us reap the benefits from.:):):)
 
Before the "forum voices" condemn the BOD and the MOA,
I think we need to take a breath here, show some mutual respect and get the personal vendettas out of the way.

If not we could easily end up the way the AMA has gone , total loss of respect for the members, the BOD and loss of members by the boat load.

Most of us, at least i think so , belong to the MOA for friendship , help with maintenance, advice on gear , and for many other reasons .
But mostly because we like BMW motorcycles
( well the chicks who ride them are pretty hot too):brow

Lets all remember we do this" hobby" for fun, very few are lucky enough to get paid for riding , sharing their adventures and telling us arm chair riders about them.

I doubt the BOD get enough reimbursement for their time and trouble to account for the tough decisions they need to make so stuff gets done , that many of us reap the benefits from.:):):)

Some may think I am attacking the MOA BOD. I am not and I just stating a fact if you want changes to where and when you want the rally or other items within the MOA. You need to have individuals who have your interest in the organization. I will be the first person to look myself in the mirror and say I am at fault because I did not do this or that for the organization. But I can say this in the past I did try to make improvements to the MOA, somewhere declined and other issues were implemented. If the weather was cooler at this rally this thread would not have been an issue. At the time of the rally I had well over 30 plus days of riding in the heat, rain, 20-60 mph wind gust, and dust storms. I enjoyed it all because I was doing what I love to do. This time I looked myself in mirror and said to myself. I do not want to go this rally because of the heat, not because of the rally location or other issues. The MOA BOD cannot control the weather nor can I. We just need to make smarter decisions and have individuals who have your interest if you want changes in this organization.
 
Before the "forum voices" condemn the BOD and the MOA,
I think we need to take a breath here, show some mutual respect and get the personal vendettas out of the way.

There's a history here. The BoD will not use the forum for club biz because they get beat up -- and I don't blame them for that. The issues are real, however, and the survey did not reflect that.
 
I didn't go because I was on our boat in the North Channel of Lake Huron at a sailing rally. I'm sorry that I had to sleep under a blanket every night because of the cool weather while some of my MOA friends found it too hot to attend. (Well, not that sorry. :nyah)

The members of the sailing organization sat around bemoaning the declining membership and the lack of younger members. Sound familiar?????

The BOD has spent a lot of time and effort trying to figure out a strategy that will ensure that MOA will be here 20 years from now. I applaud their efforts and hope they will succeed. If we have a few missteps along the way, we will make a course correction and try something different.

Younger people are not "joining" like our parents did or like we do. It is true of the Lions, Elks, Moose, Masons, most churches and other membership organizations. It is a reflection of a culture change where social media has replace or superseded the traditional forms of "joining".

Some Chartered Clubs have figured out a way to get riders engaged on a regular basis and they have active, growing membership. The often have non-motorcycle events to ensure that spouses, children and SO's can be involved as well. They don't burn out their Leadership by having in place a program so you have a term end date, rather than being President (or other leadership position) for life. If there is a training program in place and a defined term with a replacement ready to step up, more people will say "yes" when asked.

What does this have to do with the Rally? Good question. If those who have strong opinions about how the BOD is not adequately providing leadership to the MOA then they have to do more than complain, if they want different results. Remember the definition about doing the same thing time over and over yet expecting different results?

If the BOD has to fill vacancies because of lack of candidates, no on should complain about their choice. They are doing what they believe to be the right thing. The give countless hours so that the rest of us can enjoy the benefits.

I became a Lifetime Member after attending several Board meetings and seeing the high quality of individuals involved in MOA leadership positions. I believe this to still be the situation today.

The majority of our members seem to be satisfied with the ON as the primary benefit of membership. Several other thousands seem to also want to have a Rally experience. Hundreds of others work very hard to make all of this happen.

I had the privilege to be Chartered Club Liaison for a couple of years. The many individuals that I had contact with from Chartered Clubs convinced me that w/o Chartered Clubs, MOA would quickly die. Why? Because if you look at the BOD, the Rally Chairs, the hundreds of volunteers that make a Rally possible and the volunteers who make the Regional Events possible, the majority have a background of serving at the Chartered Club level. Chartered Clubs are the training grounds for service at the National Level. Check out the current ON for a list of Chartered Clubs near you.

As an example, my replacement, Paul Mulhern, was very involved in his Chartered Club in TX and was willing to serve at a higher level. He has done a great job during a difficult time when BMW set new requirements for the use of their intellectual property. All of that time, effort and frustration was w/o compensation. If you get a chance, drop him an e-mail and say thanks.

To wrap it all up, if you desire change, it starts with you. Express your opinion here, send an e-mail to the BOD, write to the ON, get involved with a Chartered Club. Volunteer. Run for the BOD. Just think, if you had been a candidate last election, you would have won a seat with only one vote (you would vote for yourself, right?):thumb

One mans opinion. YMMV

PS Now that I'm back on a bike, hope to see you on the road.
 
Doug 40427

Doug, no offense taken and I'm truely sorry if that's how I came off. It's some of the responses to your inquiry and imaginary facts that I responded to, not your question. We've addressed this question several time before which I'm sure you were unaware of. Sadly, in my mind, we have a few negative posters who are quick to post but that seems to be the extent of their contribution. It's easy to get truely involved. Even up to the BoD level. Anyone can look up the requirements and run for office. There is no secret cult running things at the MOA. The MOA is lead by people who are willing to get involved and do things instead of talking about what others are doing wrong. It does, at times, get frustrating to give a lot of time to any organization to constantly have pot shots taken at you. Especially when many of the shooters are repeat attackers who never do more than bit*@ ... "voice their displeasure" but never step up and take on a job at any level to improve things.

I think some people want the attention and it's simpler to get negative recognition by punching buttons on a keyboard than it is to get involved and try to improve things you feel need improving.

At this point I'm done with this thread. I assure you most BoD members and other Key Volunteers follow the forums regularly. Seldom do we respond as it almost always brings the folks looking for an arguement out of the woods. We are obviously all blessed to have the freedom to take away from this discussion what we choose. I have other things to do. I'm sorry I didn't respond sooner but I took a 300 mile ride today and tried on a new riding suit or two.:bikes

Stan Herman
 
In my previous business career I always asked my people to look for the" second right thing" . We were there for Consultation not Confrontation.

It's always easy to find fault with the other party, the true leader finds the good and right thing, superior leaders find the 2nd right thing.


If Vetbmwrider is so unhappy with the way things are being done, he needs to step up and state his positions clearly and positively, get his name on the ballot and make the changes he wants. ( no slam on him if for what ever reason he cannot do this) but an older wiser persons once told me " you are either part of the solution, or part of the problem" your choice.

If the weather suits my old bones tomorrow I'll get my old AirHead out and go for a ride , knowing my club has my best interest at heart.:thumb
 
I went to the rally. It was refreshing compared to Bloomsburg. I did my seminars. The air conditioning was wonderful. Folks didn't flee because it was too hot, and I didn't have to outshout cooling fans in a sheep barn. I don't always agree with the Board. I didn't always agree with the Board when I was on it. I didn't always agree with the Board when I was President. That is the way of majority rule with an elected Board.

I personally liked the "hotel rally" (we camped) when the Board got crucified for trying something different. I wish they would do it again. I liked the June midweek rally in Texas, and it wasn't near as hot as Lima, Spokane, Bloomsburg, or York. But they got yelled at then too because it wasn't in July and wasn't Thursday-Sunday.

That said, I am odd man out because every valid random sample survey done in the last 20 years divulged that a majority of members like the July weekend format. I agree that cool is better than hot, but guessing the weather a couple of years in advance is iffy at best. I can recall at least 3 rallies where the temperatures were 15 degrees above normal.

But I think the solution is to go back to Canada, midweek, in June.
 
Back
Top