Roundel Patches, jeesh

I was at Holt's yesterday shooting the breeze. Asked Marvin if they had any roundel patches. My Dad recently got ahold of a /6 and would be a nice addition to his other patches.

Lo and behold, Marvin said BMW doesn't issue patches or anything along those lines anymore. He's says if you do find one it's bootleg and dealership shirts with the roundel are straddling the line.

Made me think of Motorrad and the MOA logo issue. My gosh, ridiculous stuff if you ask me. Afraid a rider will use the patch not in agreement to the branding guidelines. I maybe behind the times here but patches and motorcycles go hand in hand and think a company would want them out there.

As I travel around, I try to stop in the local shops and pick up a hat with BMW and the shop name on it, well I tried. Could not really find any hats. Was told by several places that BMW would not allow them to put the shop name on the hat with the roundel. Shirts seem to be okay though. But I have notied most of the new shirts have BMW Motorcycles on the front with nothing else. The shop logo and name are always on the back.

Was also shown some very large carpet mats at one shop that were made to be put down inside the front doors to welcome folks. Before the shop opened, BMW did their walk through and were upset that people would be walking across the roundel. The shop was told they could not have the mats on display for the public to walk on. The mats were in the shop area for the techs to walk on. By the front door? Plan black mats.

criminaldesign said:

My gosh, ridiculous stuff if you ask me.

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Oh, not a bit.

If a company loses control of its logo, it loses control totally and completely and forever. You have to continually/constantly demonstrate you intend to protect your property.

If you had a design as old and revered and respected as BMW's, you'd be protective, too.

A lot of things in life wouldn't be so nice without copyright, trademark, etc., protection. Think music, art, literature, shop manuals, football/baseball stuff, on and on.

No one is "entitled" to another's property.

lkchris said:

Oh, not a bit.

If a company loses control of its logo, it loses control totally and completely and forever. You have to continually/constantly demonstrate you intend to protect your property.

If you had a design as old and revered and respected as BMW's, you'd be protective, too.

A lot of things in life wouldn't be so nice without copyright, trademark, etc., protection. Think music, art, literature, shop manuals, football/baseball stuff, on and on.

No one is "entitled" to another's property.

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I agree, but why wouldn't BMW themselves make (or license)a roundel patch and make it easily accessible to the marketplace??? It seems to me that most of the type of other businesses/organizations that you mention strive to create brand awareness and offer an incredible amount of merchandise with their logos. I'm certain I can get an Aerosmith TM t-shirt or even Boston Red Sox TM boxer shorts very easily if I chose. I'm certain that they both think that their brand is old and revered too. Why is it like pulling teeth to get decent BMW merchandise?

Have to agree with lkchris this time.

I have a hat but it's from BMW Lifestyle which I believe is owned by them.

RTFlyer said:

I agree, but why wouldn't BMW themselves make (or license)a roundel patch???

I'm guessing I can get a Ford, Benz, Volvo, or any other logo patch from that company (or licensee) who would be happy to put their brand out there.

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Unfortunately, it seems like BMW has decided to go for exclusivity. Most of the roundels you do see, like on the BMW riding gear, are tiny. Same with the key fob they sent me when I bought a new bike a couple years ago. It's the opposite approach from what Harley has done, which is to license their logo to just about every possible thing from beer to Zippo lighters.

About 15 years ago I recall hearing a story from the owner of Cascade Motorcycles about the dealer meeting he had just been to. They brought out a model wearing a leather bomber jacket with a big roundel on the back. The dealers applauded. BMW then said that this was exactly what they were NOT going to make...

This is one reason why the club logo issue continues to burn. Clubs only get to use the roundel in their approved logo, nowhere else. A part of the deal is that clubs may only sell merchandise with their logo (and hence, the roundel) to their members. A lot of clubs, therefore, make a separate line of merchandise with just their "signet", the part of the logo that is their own design. I'm part of the Vintage BMW Motorcycle Owners, and we do this. But a big red V with an R32 doesn't really mean a lot to people who aren't already interesed in vintage Beemers.

Don't mean to hijack, but I stopped in at a BMW dealer in Baden, Austria this past spring. The nice man gave me this. Their web address is on the back as well.

Karen,

Was that a BMW motorcycle dealer or an automobile dealer?

I deal with this stuff being a graphic designer. Along with creating a brand/logo, you have to produce a manual on the proper usage of brand/logo. Like how the logo will be used in black and white, color, monochromatic... all the possible different outputs.

I understand a company not wanting to loose control of their property right and logo usage. ...but a patch and similar swag? You think the company would be all about the rider/driver creating awareness like RTFlyer mentioned. Not that BMW needs awareness though.

You can go into a Harely shop and have about a gazillion different patches and such to choose from and not just the standard Harley shield. There's a ton of people out there that doesn't even have a Harley but have a handful of swag.

It just comes across a bit pretentious. I don't know. I'm beating a dead horse here. I'm going to take a ride. Later, h

I have (2) different key fobs from (2) different m/c dealers with the Rondel on one side and dealer's name on the other..so..what's the problem..?

Someone can correct me if I am wrong, but don't HD dealers have to pay a royalty on their shop shirts to HD?

I think HD makes more off of merchandise than bikes.

BMW AG would not be happy with this as well I imagine...reminded me of a large orange sticker commonly seen in truck windows...I pulled in behind him one day

As far as trademark usage...I cannot understand the freak out of a likeness as long as you were not trying to market anything different than the original...and were not selling hot dogs or deodorant called BMW with the logo in the name.
And Houston...they do have a huge manual given out at the MOA rally to clubs...400 pages and still muddy

anyways..the funny pic... good thing he is not BMW Carpentry...I blocked his plate # so he doesn't get sued due to me!

Do you suppose this is why no one gets a BMW tattoo...

I created my own policy. I don't advertise anybody's stuff unless they are willing to pay me. Life is less complicated now.

henzilla said:

BMW AG would not be happy with this as well I imagine

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The truck owner has no problem. Trademark protection normally does not apply to personal use. That is covered by the first amendment. You can make logos for yourself all day long. The minute you sell them, give them away, or use them in your business, the laws apply. Artists are usually exempt as long as the logo is incidental to the work, not the reason for the work. A calendar with BMWs is not a violation, selling a "BMW Calendar" requires permission.

We just went though all this recently in the model railroad industry.

The person who made and sold the decal is the one whom BMW would be interested talking too.

SIBUD said:

Karen,

Was that a BMW motorcycle dealer or an automobile dealer?

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Both. Cars in one building, bikes in another, side by side. (hmmm, sounds like a song there somewhere).
I think the salesman got extra interrested when I talked to him about the 1,500 EU carbon fiber helmet in their BMW catalog.

s09rwmb said:

Do you suppose this is why no one gets a BMW tattoo...

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.

One of the problems with patches is that you can't easily make the current logo.

You'll note that the current roundel is curved and in images it always appears curved. The old style logo was flat, like the roundels on the tank of my R100, which was easy to render to stitching. The new one, with its shading (see Darryl's avatar for an example) is not easily rendered to stitching.

I think that's why we don't see patches.

I'll say this: when I was a kid, I backpacked a lot and had a ton of patches I'd earned for various treks. However, these days, I can't think of the last time I sewed a patch on anything. I've got an old Eclipse tank bag with an MOA patch I sewed on it. The patch is in tough shape from having me crouched over it all those miles, so I might be sewing a new patch on for the first time in about 15 years.

I guess I should add that I couldn't really care less about patches, myself. I've got a drawer in my desk and all the pins, stickers and patches I get, I just toss them in there and forget about them.

But I know that a lot of people like them and want them, and I long ago learned that it seems very few people have their head screwed on the same way I do.

Dave, the roundel in the new logos is so small that the shading is irrelevant (it's just 18% of the height). A patch of any realistic size is just going to have a blob of black, white and blue.

72598 said:

There was a guy in Sturgis that will make any patch you want. He is skirting copyright laws by making them to order and not having them pre-made. (also no two the same) This way they are not considered a product as such but are called "art" (Has Harley's lawyers going crazy, someone should do this with BMW patches too)

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I'll purchase one..